CNN is predicting (as of my writing) that Obama has won Ohio and has 281 electoral votes to Romney's 201. Thus, they're predicting that President Obama has won a second term.

The remaining states are Virginia (slim Obama lead), Florida (slim Obama lead), Colorado (slim Obama lead), and Alaska (obvious Romney state). Those, plus 2 uncalled electoral votes from Nebraska (splits their electoral votes) makes 56 remaining electoral votes.

EDIT: Just as I posted this, CNN gave Colorado to Obama also. So it's 290 Obama to 201 Romney.

Yay!

Hooray! I like what Mike Thompson says below:

Mike Thompson cartoons - Detroit Free Press
If I could make a suggestion to Democrats: Celebrate, but don't gloat and don't rub it in. This election pushed us apart and now we all need to pull together. We are facing some huge problems and no one person, nor one party can solve them alone.

Agreed 100%!

A sigh of relief... This confirms it -- you are no longer a nation dominated by frightened white males and their stupid wives.

Congratulations!

MSU

I could help it.

And if your Republican party chooses to continue exclusively to represent that demographic, they will never again win a presidential election.

The Republican Party is well aware of that. Their constituency is dwindling, and they will have to make some sober and difficult realignments to their positions to remain a viable political influence. They will have to shed their domination by the Tea Party, and appeal to young educated voters, women, Hispanics, and other immigrants. Their continuing on their current path will make them increasingly irrelevant, and they will go the way of the Whigs in a decade or two.

We are a nation of immigrants, we always have been, It has been the source of our vitality, and we have always been able to assimilate and adjust to wave after wave of newcomers with new ways and ideas, looking for a new life of opportunity.

Personally, I believe they will do what they have to in order to reposition, and regain their role of the loyal opposition. If they can shed their extremest elements they can survive.

Shelly

I'm not clear on Grover Norquist's degree of influence in The Republican Party but we were subjected to a long post-election TV interview with him last night and if his nauseating views are anything to go by what you suggest just ain't gonna happen. He was loud in his praise of the Tea Party and claimed (I'll have to take his word for this unless someone can correct it) that most of the Republican House wins over Democrats were by Tea Party candidates.

I know concession speeches are by tradition polite, but I thought it was a bit rich for Romney to talk about working together after the last couple of years of rampant obstructionism. But perhaps that was simply because he hadn't done any preliminary work on a concession speech (so he said).

I also note that Boehner is already making comparatively hostile noises.

You are #2 on that short list. Politics has always been a nasty business. The gracious loser is about to fade away, but you couldn't help one last dig for no apparent reason. Well done.

A thing that complicates issues in us of a (our own brand of peculiarity) is that despite the Democrats holding the oval office and a slim lead in u s senate, the Republicans solidly hold the house of representatives AND majority of statehouses. That is where, on the state level, where district dividing lines are drawn, that Republicans have great power now. AND, the tighter gerrymandering of districts by Republicans in past 20 years leads to ever more strident Republicans and TeaParty types in the U S congress. THAT is why Norquist can be so confident of continued successful resistance in the house of representatives. This will continue to be a thorn in the side of Democrats for a long time to come.

The responses I do receive, combined with my contrary nature, seldom allow me the luxury of allowing the last word. So I rarely do.

Besides, one man's pissing contest is another man's friendly discussion.

Also, you may still come here and enjoy all the more agreeable folks without responding to me, or, for that matter, even paying me attention.

Just to be safe, whenever you spot either the avatar of the little green frog or a photo of the lovely Shania, you may safely assume it's James being disagreeable -- then simply avert your eyes, and/or hold your nose, and move along.

He brought up a very valid situation. There are about 3 or 4 Canadians and 1 Australian that spend their time here bitching about the US and telling us how we should run this Country. That is after they always bitch about their own Countries and the officials they put in charge. Take a good look at the number of regular members that post here anymore and the constant begging for money above which has become almost impossible because so many members are sick of coming here and listening to the bitching. The number of regulars has dwindled to a handful and you are a large part of the reason why. You can keep up your pissing contests and talk to yourself, we don't care anymore. There are no civil discussions here, any attempts to discuss items now just bring insults.

Ed W.

"IN GOD WE still TRUST - ALL OTHERS, WE used to MONITOR"

As long as US policies continue to strongly affect and influence other countries, Canada and Australia included, you will have to get used to commentary from outside of your borders. Failure to accept that is to show your lack of support for your own country's freedoms, namely the freedom of speech.

James may occasionally come off as abrasive and, on occasion, he does cause my blood to boil just a tad, but he is generally astute in his observations, although often a tad blunt in his presentation. Paul, however, has shown consistent maturity and intelligence in his posts.

Disagree with what is being posted, for that is your right, but please leave the attacks to those posts that merit such action.

Dave

Seems to me I've heard that song before. It's sorta like Christmas music -- comes along like clockwork about once a year.

And, like Bing Crosby and White Christmas, seems it's always the same guy singing it.

I was told eight years ago, shortly after I first arrived here, that I'd soon be the death of this place. It's a minor miracle PCQ&A has survived my toxicity this long.

Maybe if I took an extended sabbatical things would begin to look up. OK. Elections over and things are gonna be kinda slow. So, let's give it a try.

If the flock has substantially increased by the New Year, I'll take that as a sign you're right and I'll not come back. Gives you an incentive to do some recruiting, Ed.

Best of luck.

Say goodnight, Shania.

James, you've said that in the past. It never passes, however, and you'll soon be back - likely a lot sooner than you think.

Dave

Jan 1st, 2013, unless Ed is right or the Big Guy has other plans.

Very last word till then. Promise.

I still love you.

Visit the Basement

And I love you, too, Whipper.

I wanna motorboat Shania!

You know that is impossible James. It took time for it to get to this point, it will take a long time to see a change. It means everyone has to change and show a little respect for other peoples opinions or the forum is doomed, unless you are going to foot the bill yourself. Every comment doesn't need an insult or name calling which had become the norm here from many posters including moderators. Many of us have found it is easier to just lurk occasionally in the forum and many more have completely left for good. Count the number of regulars, it is getting impossible to pay for the forum while everyone claims free speech is why they bitch all they want. Free speech isn't free when it drives everyone away. This was not just directed at you James, it is for everyone that wants the Forum to stay alive. You leaving for two months will accomplish nothing. There are too many self proclaimed experts here that just drive others away. Time for everyone including me to look in the mirror.

The constant negative comments and name calling is dragging this forum into oblivion. Just my opinion. I rest my case.

Ed W.

"IN GOD WE still TRUST - ALL OTHERS, WE used to MONITOR"

This is without a doubt the most polite and respectful forum that I have ever seen (referring only to those who allow political discussion).

QUOTE:

This is without a doubt the most polite and respectful forum that I have ever seen (referring only to those who allow political discussion).

---

Paul D



I agree. There is an occasional argument over politics > but for the most part this forum has the most civil and polite discussions compared to the ongoing trashy stuff I have seen at many other forums; and the amount of troll flame garbage is nearly non existent here.

This forum is well behaved for the most part and very helpful.

  

Yeah, this place self-moderates pretty well.

Funny though - I hang out in a few heavily moderated forums, family friendly and all that, but the tone and temper of many conversations is rude and insulting. You can't say "shit" but you can be a dick all you want. Eye of the beholder I guess.

As to James, I always imagine guys like him walking around with sharp sticks in their belts, let's say yellow ones. When they see someone with an orange stick they run at each other and start poking. Now, if a stickman starts poking at a non-sticker, that's a problem, but as long as it's two stickmen, just relax and enjoy the show.

As to the election, I think I got it figured. According to some pretty smart Republicans, they lost because of Sandy. The logic is that the storm allowed people to see that Obama is a pretty good president. But, a hurricane is an act of God, so, well, God must be getting hair pullingly frustrated with Republicans.

I mean, first he decides to make the point to arrange a dufus like Romney as the candidate. But as a little insurance, he arranges for some wacky billionaire to keep poring money to a dingbat like Gingrich, so Romney will have a hard, expensive primary fight. This allows the black guy to get a head start on the real campaign.

Then the Republicans realize what trouble they're in with a dufus as a candidate, so they start cheating at the state level, trying all sorts of tricks to keep Democrats from voting. God sighs and brings on the hurricane, at just the right time, and people, even a blowhard like Christie, see what a good guy the president is.

I mean really, if Obama winning isn't proof of God, what else do you need?

Do you think James will respond to this? Probably not, I don't think he likes me.

The only effect Sandy had on the election was to reduce President Obama's vote total because so many in New York and New jersey were unable to vote at all.

Romney never had a chance, which was obvious to all but the professional pundits as usual. Nate Silver's election forcast based upon rational statistical analysis was 100% corect and consistant in predicting the electoral vote for the entire campaign period It's lowest probability for an Obama win was about 65% right after the first debate, and was as as high as 96% at times.

There were two big winners in the election, Barack Obama, and Nate Silver who with esquisite accuracy determined the election results in all 50 states and the district of Columbia. As you already know, I never doubted the election results for a moment.

Shelly

It all came down to Ohio. Can you imagine if Obama had lost Ohio - that would have put Florida in play again.

I didn't understand it until yesterday, reading an article on the Republican's after-thoughts on Ohio. Apparently they believed their own bs. They were shocked to lose Ohio - they looked at the southern vote (coal) and ignored the northern (auto) vote. They were surprised by the large minority turnout (percentage wise larger than '08 I believe.)

This explains Rove's meltdown on Fox News - he thought he had the inside scoop. I guess he never thought black voters would turn out for Obama in a state that overtly tried to suppress them, or that auto workers would be offended at being lied to about their own jobs.

I never understood the utter corruption of mind of their power structure until now. It's one thing to run a campaign devoid of ideas, to think a slick marketing campaign, like selling soap, would work. But to actually believe that marketing themselves is something I can't wrap my brain around at all.

My personal take is that the politics of hate finally caught up with them. I wonder what the next group to hate they'll find? Probably you and me - old white men who voted for Obama

I would point out that the reason Republicans still control the House of Representatives is because of the 2010 election which allowed the Republican governors and state houses to redistrict their states based upon the 10 year census and gerrymander their states to favor Republican candidates.

All elections have consequences.

Oh, and by the way, Obama would still have won without Ohio!

Shelly

The engine for the 2010 election was, as always, mid-term voting patterns (extremists turn out, normal people don't.) This is true no matter the party, so neither party should object to a national voting system seems to me.

If you were registered at age, it followed you for life, and the act of voting was easy and efficient, it might be interesting. At the very least, it would be one less thing to be embarrassed about as an American.

What makes things difficult is that federal law governs national election candidates, state law governs state candidates, and local municipalities govern local candidates.

One solution could be a non-partisan national commission to make the rules for all elections, and make rational geographic boundaries, such as perhaps counties the unchangeable election districts to eliminate gerrymandering, to form imaginative district boundaries favoring a particular party.

this nation went through a civil war, to create a unified nation rather than a collection of independent states. Over 650,000 Americans died in that war to settle forever whether the United States are or the United States is.

Shelly

That's a very good description of the Australian system.

You just proved my point Paul, than you.

Ed W.

"IN GOD WE still TRUST - ALL OTHERS, WE used to MONITOR"

I would like to congratulate the citizens of the United States of America for making an intelligent choice, once again. I would also like to state that I felt Mitt Romney's speech, once the results were known, to be well stated. He acted professionally and appropriately and, for this, I have gained a little bit of respect for the man.

Dave

Romney is a decent person who succumbed to pandering to the worst elements of his party in a sad attempt to be President. That is over and he has the luxury of decency again.

As long I have known politics you can count on about 1/3 of the public being right, about another 1/3 being wrong. and another1/3 having an IQ that hovers at about room temperature. I have friends in all three groups.

Shelly

As I've said before, to gain nomination a Republican candidate has no choice but to pander to the extreme right. But once nomination is gained he/she then has to swing left, because it's the undecided centre who really decide the election. Hence any Republican candidate is going to appear floppy.

Lincoln, Theodore Roosevelt, Eisenhower, and Reagan, could not receive a Presidential nomination from today's Republican Party.

Think about that!

Shelly

Whereas Nixon probably could.

Actually, I think Nixon would be considered a liberal by today's GOP. He opened relations with China (instead of threatening to bomb them if they didn't agree to US positions), he also had plans for a national health care system. Why the guy was virtually a socialist! (tongue firmly in cheek on that last statement, of course.)

Right now it looks like any elections the GOP loses they attribute to not being extreme enough and they veer further right. If they don't change course, they'll run right over the cliff.

MSU

And the usual shambles in Florida.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-elections/why-florida-is-missing-from-the-results-map-8293652.html

...The Miami Herald reports: “When polls officially closed at 7pm hundreds of people were still waiting to cast ballots in precincts around South Florida, in an election that was marked by long lines and the occasional snafu. Even after the networks called the race for President Obama, people in South Florida remained in line.”

It reports that 80 per cent of the Miami Dade precincts still had queues fours hours after the polls should have closed. Some voters had waited six hours. About 18,000 “absentee” ballots also came through on polling day.

“At Ronald Reagan High School in Doral, the doors closed with some 300 people still in line. By law, any voter who arrived before 7pm is allowed to cast a ballot.”...

Everyone needs to put a sock in it! .. The Presidential election is over for the next four years, but the devastation and suffering (and now freezing and blizzard conditions) of those affected by Hurricane Sandy will last for many more weeks, months, years!

So how about some constructive discussions for a change ... does anyone know of any honest and helpful charities that are setup to assist those who have been left homeless? ... (and don't even suggest The American Red Cross, they are far from being what they portray!)

Thankfully common sense prevailed last night and intelligence from the Northeners steamrolled the rednecks from the South.

WTH is wrong with some of those people in Texas ,they're living in the wild west of the 50's!!!


Have a great day all!

http://rss.cnn.com/~r/rss/cnn_topstories/~3/GwKYVf2c2K4/index.html
Have a great day all!

Wow. So Republicans are trying to claim that it was 1) Hurricane Sandy's fault for stopping Romney's momentum, 2) Chris Christie's fault for actually working with President Obama when his people needed help, and 3) Romney's fault for not being far right enough?

Yes, Sandy disrupted politics. These things happen. Chris Christie was acting in a non-partisan manner to get help to people in his state. To say "it won't be forgotten easily" is to sound like the kind of "we've got to only focus on winning even if it means hurting the people we're supposed to represent" mentality that people hate. And, as far as Romney not being far-right enough, it sounds like parts of the Republican party are responding to the vote by veering off the far-right cliff to get more votes. Either the other Republicans are going to take control of the party and steer them back towards the center, the Republican party is going to split into Moderate Republicans and Far-Right Republicans, or the Republican party will quickly slide into obsolescence.

With all due respect, that's a great idea, but it merits a thread of its own. Why don't you start one?

Your post will simply get lost in this thread.

There is a lot of gloom and doom about the Republican party in this thread. The party isn't as dead as some in this thread make them out to be.

The popular vote in the election was practically 50/50 and the Republicans still control the House.

For as unpopular as they were in 2008, they made gains in 2010, and came close this time around.

Visit the Basement

MSU

2:1 in electoral votes, almost 3 million in popular votes and picking up seats in the Senate. Any reasonable conclusion is Romney and the Republicans were pointedly rejected.

What's interesting to me about the House, is that where lots of people vote (President and Senate) Dems did well - where small numbers vote in protected districts, Reps did well. Time after time after time, in multiple elections, Senate candidates that would likely make it in the House, were rejected for Senate seats.

The only way this country moves in a positive direction is if moderate Republicans reject the extremists in their party. And the very organized extremists will fight like Hell to keep that from happening, as it would be their end.

I hate to say it, but the people who are going to save this country, in the near term, are Senate Republicans. If a group of them can work with Obama, then they can isolate the House whackos, and Mitch, and do something useful for a change.

The Republican circular firing squad has already begun to form. They are still a long way from building a viable future.

I hope they come to their senses quickly, we need a government that works again.

Shelly

Your country's demographics are changing. You, as are we in Canada, are shifting color from white to beige, and very soon we will be brown. Republicans need to open up the window drapes in that incestuous little dark room they now occupy and have a gander at the folks passing by in the street. The balding white heads that comprise the Republican base are thinning as fast as are the hairs on them.

Women are not going back to being barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen, gays are not going back into the closet, Asians are not going to stop excelling academically, blacks are not going back to riding the back of the bus, and Latinos are not going to voluntarily put themselves on one to be driven back to the hell they've escaped from.

Unless your Republican party gets with it, they are doomed to obsolescence. Already they have isolated themselves in gerrymandered exurban districts, where Norman Rockwell remains the illustrator of choice and the King James version is science.

The popular vote this time was split about evenly, next time the gap will widen, and soon -- as far as occupying the White House and Senate are concerned -- leaping tall buildings in a single bound will be a feat more achievable.

Is it New Years already, James? I believe that was a full three days - but that would pretty much be a record now, wouldn't it?

Welcome back. I should have put money on this one.

Dave

As I mentioned, I believe it's New Years in Tibet.

You would have to have given odds.

BTW, did my latest observation cause your blood to boil or did it just come to a simmer?

Actually, it seems you're a little off your regular mark. Are you losing your edge?

Dave

I had an edge?

http://theweek.com/article/index/235977/the-multibillion-dollar-2012-election-by-the-numbers

Is what this election cost,that's ludicrous.

Imagine the programs that could have benefitted from that much money.


Have a great day all!

Neither candidate used public funding, so no programs would have benefited.

NB, I'm not disagreeing with your general sentiments. The costs are absurd. As is the fact that every President in recent years has spent half his term in campaign mode.

And let's not forget that this waste was made possible by a conservative Supreme Court giving the nod to Super PACs.

Ahh, the SuperPacs. A survey showed that that millions spent by individuals and special interest groups did not affect the outcomes of the various elections in their favor but with one exception, which was a Senate race. Otherwise, they couldn't buy the election.

I came across another figure today. It seems that the popular vote differed by a little over 300,000 votes. That was the margin that could have changed the outcome of the presidential election.
JP

You lost a zero. The popular vote margin was over 3 million. Not that it matters all that much, apart from statistical interest. Ask GWB.

Keep cheering for the liar guys. It's obvious that the stock market loves him. Of course stockholders don't matter it's the welfare recipents and the illegal immigrants that keep this country running. Those on the public dole are going to create a lot of jobs and solve the unemployment problem, right? Ogama's mentor, George Soros led the Jews, his own people, to slaughter; a nice guy don't you think? It is amazing that the majority of Jews suppport Obama who, as a Muslim, hates the Jews. He told the same lies this time around as he did in 2008 and the same fools believed him again. Oh well what's another five or six trillion in debt. It will take another twenty years before we become Greece. Keep drinking that Kool Aid guys. I'll be long gone before the country goes down the tubes so I don't give a damn. Using logic with a liberal socialist is like picking up a turd by the clean end...it can't be done.

Who exactly is drinking the Koolaid and peddling the lies here? No doubt you're a birther as well.

Hate to hurt your feelings, Paul but you don't live here so no one cares what you think. You Aussies have enough problems without worrying about ours. When you solve your own come back and see us.

At last! Someone who's crazier than me.

Don't flatter yourself. The likelihood of you hurting my feelings is non-existent. I don't worry about nutcases.

Obama is a Muslim? Oh, please. And the comment about Soros is equally divorced from reality. It is a deliberate selective misinterpretation of small parts of what actually happened, and is just one more example of the depths to which the far right crazies in the USA are prepared to sink.

What I enjoyed most was his comment that when the country is finally down the socialist drain he'll be dead and in fascist heaven, so he doesn't give a damn.

I live here, and I care what Paul thinks.

Your blind ignorance is only surpassed by your obvious lack of understanding of virtually any comment you have made. Absolutely incredible!

Once again I am reminded of a song from the Wizard Of Oz. I believe James knows of what I am thinking.

Dave

Ray Bolger's lament?

You got it.

Dave

I thought the whole "Obama's a Muslim" stuff went away years ago. It's been disproved over and over and the only ones who still believe that are conspiracy theorists who are completely divorced from reality.

Mind you, even if he were a Muslim, that wouldn't qualify him from being President. Nowhere in the Constitution does it state that the President needs to be Christian. We could have a Jewish President, an Atheist President, a Wiccan President, etc. and it would be perfectly constitutional. In addition, being Muslim doesn't automatically make you hate Jews. There are plenty of white Christians who hate Jews. (Exhibit A: The Westboro Baptist Church, Exhibit B: President Richard Nixon)

I'd certainly bet on it.

Dave

It's truly amazing to me that anyone disagreeing with you socialist liberals is crazy. Aren't you supposed to be the caring, understanding party while us conservatives are the hard hearted,non-caring SOBs that won't listen to reason. I might be crazy but I'm not two-faced enough to preach one philosophy and practice another. BTW, I was responsible for the drawings that build, refuel and overhaul the nations only nuclear powered aircraft carriers; how many of you socialist can do that? You reckon they teach that at the social services office? After reading what you people have to say; if you're smart I'm damned glad to be crazy. Forums are for open discussions; this one is a joke. If you can't disagree with someone without calling them crazy then shut the fuck up, you lack the intelligence to be in the discussion. You can crucify me all you want to make yourselves feel smarter; I won't waste my time with this pretend forum anymore.

Promise?

It's nice that we've given you something to feel good about after the disappointment of the last couple of weeks.

Cashtonh does have a point. Some can not discuss a difference of opinion without resorting to personal attacks. This thread contains several.

Nightly Reader

In the main initiated by castonh and another radical far right poster. Post #78 isn't an attack (and a pretty hysterical one at that) on everyone who doesn't share his viewpoint?

If you like I can direct you to a forum that contains REAL personal attacks. As I have already said, this is probably the politest political forum on the internet.

Don't let that door hit you in the butt on the way out. You will likely not be missed.

Dave

You seem to think "dumb" and "crazy" are the same thing. People don't generally characterize serial killers as dumb, it misses the point.

As to dumb - if the content of your posts is evidence of your intelligence, then yes, you're dumb. Embrace it, live it, be it. Nothing to be ashamed of.

Just curious, are you signing a petition for your state to secede, or to impeach Obama. The extremists on the right seem to be splitting their resources here, just wondering where you fall on it.

:)


Have a great day all!

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