I have (or had) two computers on a network - Win SE to Win SE. It still works since I upgraded one PC to dual boot XP Pro. The connections betweeen SE in Sys 1 & SE in Sys 2 still work, but I can't seem to get networking going between XP Pro in Sys 1 & SE in Sys 2.

I've read the help in XP Pro but, sorry to say, it ain't clear enough. The local area properties have Client for usoft Networks, File & Printer Sharing, Qos Packet Scheduler, & Internet Protocol (TCP/IP) enumerated. The XP system doesn't see my second system (System2),therefore I can't map network drives like I did in SE.

Suggestions?

Fred

Fred....

I am not 100% on this but I did get my XP machine to talk to my 98se machine a while back. I think I had to creat a floppy of some sort (XP created the floppy) and then install that file/program (all a big blur) on the 98 machine. Its definetly possible, but its not as easy as two of the same OS.

See the wizard in XP and I think there is an option for networking to another machine with an older OS. I am not at home so I cant look at my XP machine to tell you for sure, sorry. Good luck...youll get it.

Thanks guys. I'm not at the stage of implementing ICS. I'm just trying to share files & printers as the first stage. I recall clearly that installing ICS does require running a floppy produced by the host computer (the one with the modem to the Internet) on the remote machine.

My problem is that SE doesn't show the XP machine in Network Neighborhood & in XP the SE machine doesn't show up in Local Area Network (the equivalent of Network Neighborhood).

I'm clearly missing something obvious - as usual.

Fred

Just keep it simple. The XP CD is all you need (floopy not required). Put your CD in Win98 or XP. Run ICS Wizard on both machines and Don't share your files.

Sonny -

I don't understand why you say to run the ICS Wizard & not share files, when I DO want to share files from one machine to another. I want to pass files between them. You could do this in Win 98SE without installing ICS. Can you do this in XP & how, please.

Fred

Sorry Fred, I misread your post. The reason I suggested ICS is not for internet sharing alone, but to use the Network Wizard from XP for ANY type of networking. It is totally rewritten and handles any type of networking you want and works, from the CD, on ALL of your PCs. On one of my clents networks I removed all netwoking from all PCs and started fresh with the XP Networking Wizard to set them up as a simple P2P network and it went smoothly. This is only a suggestion on my part and not a pat answer.

Sonny - Sorry Fred, I misread your post. The reason I suggested ICS is not for internet sharing alone, but to use the Network Wizard from XP for ANY type of networking. It is totally rewritten and handles any type of networking you want and works, from the CD, on ALL of your PCs. On one of my clents networks I removed all netwoking from all PCs and started fresh with the XP Networking Wizard to set them up as a simple P2P network and it went smoothly. This is only a suggestion on my part and not a pat answer.

Fred - That's ok. I didn't mean to be ornery. I'm reluctant to eliminate everything from the remote machine, because it connects satisfactorily with my dual boot system running Win 98SE. For that reason I'm trying to solve the XP Pro connect problem directly.

When I go to Entire Network in XP it only shows System1 - the XP system. When I try to run the Network Wizard, it renames the Workgroup to WORKGROUP from FRED, which is incorrect. I know my remote system has a unique name - SYTEM3 and Worgroup name - FRED. I am running as Administrator in XP with a name of SYSTEM1 and Workgroup name of FRED. The icon is systray shows a connection has been made, but the login is not taking place.

Frustrating as hell, though. Is there something else I have to enable? Is it worth the effort to rename SYSTEM3 workgroup name to WORKGROUP?

Thanks for your effort on my behalf.
Fred

>Fred - That's ok. I didn't mean to be ornery.

LOL Don't worry 'bout it. Networking can sometimes make you Gray (my case more hair falling out). I see what you are trying to do, at least I think I do, so I was just suggesting the Network Wizard because of it's ease. There is a way to overide the naming of your workgroup after you have set it up. I just went to Help and Support and typed in workgroup. It has a number of options the including renaming (all you have to do is get them to match). It's been a while since I've set up a network as you have done so I don't want to steer you wrong. I think a little more tweaking on the XP may accomplish what you need. For some reason I have to be sitting at the keyboard and tube to see it before I can change it. I just seem to know it instinctivly but have a hard time describing it.

Did you turn OFF the MS built in FIREWALL? IF not, do so.

Is your Network name correct?
Did you use a different "Computer name"?

Did you share the drives and/or folders on the XP machine?
Did you share the Printer on the XP machine?

David C Abernathy

David C Abernathy

Did you turn OFF the MS built in FIREWALL? IF not, do so.

I didn't enable it so how do I check?

Is your Network name correct? Yes
Did you use a different "Computer name"? System1 & System3

Did you share the drives and/or folders on the XP machine? Yes, double checked on remote machine.

Did you share the Printer on the XP machine? Yes, verified.

Right from the help center of XP Pro. This is turned on by default when you in stalled Windows XP.

To enable or disable Internet Connection Firewall

Open Network Connections
Click the Dial-up, LAN or High-Speed Internet connection that you want to protect, and then, under Network Tasks, click Change settings of this connection.
On the Advanced tab, under Internet Connection Firewall, select one of the following:
To enable Internet Connection Firewall (ICF), select the Protect my computer and network by limiting or preventing access to this computer from the Internet check box.
To disable Internet Connection Firewall, clear the Protect my computer and network by limiting or preventing access to this computer from the Internet check box.
Notes

To open Network Connections, click Start, point to Settings, click Control Panel, click Network and Internet Connections, and then click Network Connections.
You must be logged on as an administrator or a member of the Administrators group in order to complete this procedure. If your computer is connected to a network, network policy settings may also prevent you from completing this procedure.
If you clear the Protect my computer and network by limiting or preventing access to this computer from the Internet check box, the firewall on your computer is disabled, and your network is vulnerable to intrusions.
You should not enable Internet Connection Firewall on virtual private networking (VPN) connections or on client computers because ICF will interfere with file and printer sharing.
ICF cannot be enabled on the private connections of the Internet Connection Sharing host computer.
Internet Connection Sharing, Internet Connection Firewall, Discovery and Control, and Network Bridge are not available on Windows XP 64-Bit Edition.
Related Topics


David C Abernathy

David C Abernathy

I used the ICS Wizard and didn't tweak it as most people try to do and it worked with Win98, WinMe, and now XP. The only changes I had to make were to Zone Alarm and did so according to instructions on Zone Labs site for Networking with ICS.

The only thing you have to do for is, get the IP addresses of both machines, I'm almost sure they are in different IP segments. In Windows 9x use the Winipcfg command in Run, in XP go to a command prompt and use ipconfig. Post both the IP and the subnet mask.

Roni - The only thing you have to do for is, get the IP addresses of both machines, I'm almost sure they are in different IP segments. In Windows 9x use the Winipcfg command in Run, in XP go to a command prompt and use ipconfig. Post both the IP and the subnet mask.

Fred -
When I run ipconfig on the XP Pro system, I get:
192.168.0.1
255.255.255.0
When I run winipcfg on the Win 98SE system, I get:
192.168.0.1
255.255.255.0
which would conflict, but when I look at control panel, networking, I get 192.168.0.2 on the Win 98SE system. I can't account for the difference in IP Address on the Win 98SE machine depending upon the methodology.

Confusing!
Fred

Yeah, you have your problem there, it is odd, let me explain.
If you do not have ICS in any machine or a way of getting an IP through a DHCP server the machines should get an IP in the range of 169.254.xxx.yyy
If the Win 98 machine got that IP before (I mean you have not restarted the machine) it could be explained, but the XP address should be in the 169.254.xxx.yyy range unless there is a ICS service running in the Win 98 machine and you don't know it
Double check the IP address (The winipcfg and ipconfig IPs should be the right ones) and try to ping each other machine, see if for some reason ICS is installed in either machine, that would explain the IP range 192.168.xxx.yyy you are getting, that range is only used in private networks when you have an ICS service or similar running.

Roni -
Yeah, you have your problem there, it is odd, let me explain.
If you do not have ICS in any machine or a way of getting an IP through a DHCP server the machines should get an IP in the range of 169.254.xxx.yyy.




If the Win 98 machine got that IP before (I mean you have not restarted the machine) it could be explained, but the XP address should be in the 169.254.xxx.yyy range unless there is a ICS service running in the Win 98 machine and you don't know it
Double check the IP address (The winipcfg and ipconfig IPs should be the right ones) and try to ping each other machine, see if for some reason ICS is installed in either machine, that would explain the IP range 192.168.xxx.yyy you are getting, that range is only used in private networks when you have an ICS service or similar running.

Roni -

I don't know why my additions weren't printed in the last response I posted, but again -

I do have ICS installed on the Win 98SE machine but not the XP machine.

I cannot ping the SE machine from the XP machine but CAN ping the XP machine from the SE machine, although the XP machine doesn't show up in Network Neighborhood of the SE machine. Are we getting warmer?

Fred

If you have ICS in the Win 98 machine then the IP you gave me for XP machine is wrong (That will explain why you cannot ping it) it could not be 192.168.0.1 as that's the IP of the ICS service.
In the XP machine go to a Command Prompt and release the IP (ipconfig /release) and then renew it (ipconfig /renew) check the IP again (ipconfig) and ping that IP from the Win 98 computer.

Oops. I actually have ICS on the Win 98SE partition of the dual boot SE/XP system. That's the one with the modem. The other machine, SE only, was the remote machine. As I now recall, hopefully correctly, it doesn't have ICS actually running on it.

So the remote machine pings the XP machine successfully but not vice versa. Do I still follow your above instructions? Apologies for making it more complex than necessary.

Fred

If the machine with XP has ICS in the Win 98 option, that's irrelevant, as it has no bearing in the test, so forget about anything related to that.
So far I understand Win 98 machine no ICS IP 192.168.0.1 or 192.168.0.2 (You need to check this a machine without ICS cannot have address 192.168.0.1)
Machine with XP IP 192.168.0.1 (You need to check that, release and renew IP, machine not connected to a DHCP server cannot have IP address in that range)

Roni -

Tried to do the release on the XP machine. Get an error - "Operation failed - no adapter is in the state permissible for this operation".

I also did some checking on the Win 98 SE machine. The login on this machine says I have both the Domain & Workgroup set to the same thing. On the XP machine only the Workgroup can be set to that name. If I understand correctly, it's either a domain name OR Workgroup name on XP. Could this be a problem?

Fred

Let me see if I can follow you:

In Windows 98, Right Click Network Neighborhood, Properties, in the Identification Tab the Workgroup is what it is important (The XP machine has to be in the same workgroup but with a different Computer name) any other value of Domain in Windows 98 is irrelevant for the local network.
In the Configuration Tab in the TCP/IP settings for the Network card the IP settings has to be set to "obtain an IP address automatically"

In Windows XP Control Panel, Network and Internet Connections, Network Connections, double click on the local network connection, go to Properties, double click on Internet Protocol (TCP/IP) check if you have there Obtain an IP address automatically or Use the following IP address.
For the Workgroup settings Control Panel, Performance and Maintenance, System, Computer name check the workgroup is exactly the same as the other, the name of the computer has to be a different one, any other domain name somewhere else is irrelevant for the local network.

In Windows 98, Right Click Network Neighborhood, Properties, in the Identification Tab the Workgroup is what it is important (The XP machine has to be in the same workgroup but with a different Computer name) any other value of Domain in Windows 98 is irrelevant for the local network.
In the Configuration Tab in the TCP/IP settings for the Network card the IP settings has to be set to "obtain an IP address automatically"

In Windows XP Control Panel, Network and Internet Connections, Network Connections, double click on the local network connection, go to Properties, double click on Internet Protocol (TCP/IP) check if you have there Obtain an IP address automatically or Use the following IP address.
For the Workgroup settings Control Panel, Performance and Maintenance, System, Computer name check the workgroup is exactly the same as the other, the name of the computer has to be a different one, any other domain name somewhere else is irrelevant for the local network.

Roni - On the SE machine I have the same workgroup as the XP (SYSTEM1)system but with another computer name (SYSTEM3). However, I do NOT have select automatically. The PC911 instructional for SE when I set it up before XP installation said to use a specific one 192.168.0.2 for the remote system. That's what's still there.

In XP, the same is true, no automatic selection. Uses 192.168.0.1

If the domain name is irrelevant, so be it. I just noticed that SE had the same domain name as Workgroup name, but nevertheless, both XP & SE have the same Workgroup name.

Useful?

The SE machine cannot see the XP system in Network Neighborhood but can ping it. How can that be?
Fred

You can not use both "domain" name and a "Workgroup" name. If you are not using a domain server you must use the Peer2Peer workgroup. Which are you using on your non XP system?
David C Abernathy

David C Abernathy

On the SE machine, the Workgroup appears & the unique system name appears under it. Under the workgroup are all the partitions listed I want to share with the XP system.

On the XP machine, using windows explorer to get to Entire Network, under Microsoft Windows Network, the identical workgroup name shows up. Under that the unique different name appears & under that, shared printer & other things are listed.

Thanks to you & Roni for your patience with me.

Fred

And what about the Subnet Mask, are they the same?
They should change that range they have in PC911, the range 192.168.xxx.yyy is used for DHCP services and not for static IP addresses (They should use the 10.aaa.bbb.ccc range) the problem with that, is that if you decide to install ICS in the machine with IP address 192.168.0.2, you will have a conflict with the machine already set with the first IP in that range.
I do not know where is that Doamin name you are refering to, but that should not be a problem. (Is it the Doamin in the DNS settings?)
Go to a command prompt and type net view in each machine and see if the shares are visible.

Roni -

Typing net view at a command prompt yields the following:

XP machine \\SYSTEM1 AMD K6-2 533 MHZ

&

SE machine \\SYSTEM3 CYRIX 233 MHZ

Both seem correct to me.

The domain was the same name as the workgroup name in the machine login at startup on the SE machine. It says User: FZbar, then Domain Name: FRED The FRED is the same name as the workgroup names in BOTH the XP & SE machines.

Fred

Still I do not understand your settings, CAN YOU SPELL THE NAME OF THE WORKGROUP in both machines

Both workgroup names are FRED.

Also both subnet masks (XP & SE machines) are 255.255.255.0

Fred

Check that File and Printer Sharing for Microsoft Network is installed in both computers, check that you can ping each other computer (There is no reason why not, Are you using Zone Alarm or something like that?)
You can see the resources in the other computer typing for instance from SYSTEM3

net view \\system1

Roni -

No use of Zone Alarm. As before, can ping SYSTEM 1 from SYSTEM3.

When I tried net view \\SYSTEM1 from the SE machine (SYSTEM3) got an ERROR 53. Could not find that resource. Try again when it is available. This is consistent with not seeing SYSTEM1 in Network Neighborhood on SYSTEM3.

I think we are both tired. Will give up for today. Would appreciate it if you can continue to think on it. Thanks much for your patience & knowledge. Will look for any post from you tomorrow.

Fred

A few thoughts here -

The XP machine can see the 98SE machine, but not the other way around. Some setting on the XP machine is blocking access so that the 98SE machine can't see it. Those could be:

File and Printer Sharing
Network logon password
Firewall
Incorrect network address

You should try running the Networking Trouble Shooter, if you haven't done so.

It sounds you have at least configured the system far enough that both machines are actually on the network. My suggestion would be to delete the current network connection on the XP machine and start over, this time using the wizard in Networking labeled "Set up a home or small office network".

JP

I'm in the same boat & me think that Microsoft has something to do with it. The patches will be out soon.

Dave101

"The only goddamn thing you know about the law is how to break it." Chief Lafleche

Well, Dave101, while company usually feels good, that does not explain why others are able to network XP & SE. There's something going on which we clearly don't understand. BUT, I'll take the easy way out, if it's real, although I'm not prepared to simply wait for it. Something has changed in procedure & we're not seeing what it is.

Fred

In the past I have found that when ever I had stubborn networking installs that I was better off removing all network protocols ,rebooting and starting over.Good Luck tomorrow.

LilJoe

You can try setting the IP to be obtained automatically in both machines (There is no reason not to do so, even if it is in the PC911 How to) remember if you do it to release the IP addresses before you reboot. You can try running the Home Networking Wizzard in Windows XP to avoid any problem with a service that is not properly bound.
If you feel that you need an static IP in the range 192.168.xxx.yyy use something that is not near of any end of the range so avoid the 1, 2, 3 and the 250 251,252 253,254 at the end (It is not a good practice to set static IPs in this range, that's the reason the 10.aaa.bbb.ccc range was created)
As per Microsoft advice in How to Configure a Permanent IP Address for Network Devices a change in the registry should be made to avoid conflicts with IP addresses asigned by the ICS service.

Good morning. Well, I may not be thinking any better but I feel a lot better.

Joe - I hate to say it but a better & better suggestion.

Roni - I already tried letting the XP machine automatically select. I will try both doing auto select this morning.

If both fail, I will remove all networking protocols from the SE machine, then run the XP networking wizard (or whatever it's called) on the SE machine, after ghosting that machine so I can restore completely if forced to. Short of that, I may be forced to keep my dual-boot system forever so I can network. Not a great thought.

Thanks a million for your help. One of the very best reason to come to PC911 for help when you find you really have a stumper.

Fred

I don't think that you need to do anything with the 98SE machine since it's been running fine on the network. It's the XP end of things that needs changing. XP doesn't have anything about it that changes the rules of networking, it conforms to the same old standards.

Have you enabled File and Printer sharing on the XP system and then set the C: drive as Shared?

JP

Why set the C drive as shared? I have a dual boot system with Win 98SE on C & XP Pro on H. I already have printer shared. I don't show the other machine in Network Neighborhood or the XP equivalent.

Got sidetracked today by going to the computer show. Maybe networking this evening.

Fred

Very interesting. I to have the same problem although i can ping both ways.
I cant see anything from either machine.
I did have it going originally but has since stopped.
The xp is a laptop and not always on the network.

Will try again tomorrow

seasons greetings to you all

Ant

Antcj -

If you get it working, please post what is listed in your network setup - like Printer & File sharing & TCP/IP & the settings for it.

Thanks
Fred

Eurika, I found it.

Although the Pc would see my work laptop it could not see the wifes laptop with XP.

To cut a long story short remove the NIC from the device driver and reboot.(On the pc with 98.)
Reboot loads it in again. Make sure you have drivers handy in case it asks for them.


I suppose the drivers or something got corrupted.

And hey presto all ok

Ant

Thanks antcj.

I hope it works but I can't understand why for my machine. When both systems are running SE, the network runs fine. It's only when one runs XP & the other runs SE that there is the connection problem. If that's right, the XP network drivers could be bad but unlikely that the SE ones are. Heck, I'll try anything. It's the last item on my list that makes my XP install work satisfactorily to run it all of the time.

Fred

It sounds strange i agree.My setup was 98 to nt. I therefore assumed the nic was ok and all the bits to go with it.

Out of desperation does one try odd ways to rectify a problem

good luck

Ant